The New Adventures of Mr Stephen Fry » Topic: The Ode Less Travelled

The New Adventures of Mr Stephen Fry » Topic: The Ode Less Travelled http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled Just another bbPress community en-US Sat, 25 May 2013 11:34:41 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 <![CDATA[Search]]> q http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/search.php owentheeditor on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-161967 Thu, 09 Jul 2009 00:00:26 +0000 owentheeditor 161967@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ phew. Thought I was going a bit weird and unable to count...how prosaic...I shall improve: - / - / - / - / - / I thought the words had confused my own brain - / - / - / - / - / (-) and addled me with readings quite insane....ly I get two points for a hypermetric line - right? Though I'm probably docked 5 for wrenching "ly" in for getting the two... <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":D" class="bb_smilies" /> Quite apart from that, it would be interesting to talk pulse over syllables. Clearly it is the case that pulse can override syllables in the context of a line governed by metrics, but how, without having too much knowledge of the canon, should one decide when one has a discretionary other syllable and when one has a hypermetric line/deviation to hexa or (n+1)ameter? In this case it's easy, you have the simple fact that "be-", "them", "and", and "-ver" provide no additional information in the line. The line exists in the mind (at least the anglo-saxon mind) free of these gap fillers (they are prefix, pronoun, conjunction and suffix respectively - all the sense is carried in the alternate beats from these). In inflected languages you'd get away with it because you can be a bit free with your grammar (cite the fairly parsimonious use of the instrumental case in old english) and just hash the words until they fit. Or use the joy of a language like latin to the skin the cat in another form. Regardless, my point is, we have a language, in English, which has more flexibility than any other due to its wealthy heritage. Why not acheive this more completely? Or am I (I fear to tread here) reading too much into this line? Feel free to say that, will totally take it on the chin. exoskeleton on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-161885 Wed, 08 Jul 2009 21:48:36 +0000 exoskeleton 161885@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ I think it's right in the book, if I'm reading your post correctly. the book has it scanned as iambic pentameter with a weak ending? I have it sitting right next to me but I can't immediately find where that passage is used. I think it hinges on what you were hinting at-- that in this case "flowers" is meant to have only one syllable. I too would put two syllables in "flower" in normal speech, and I speak northern US English. I think it's pretty standard. btw, if you were to use two syllables for flowers, I doubt there would be accents on "and" and the "ver" of shiver anyway. I'd say: "And like the flowers beside them, chill and shiver" of course I don't know what the heck you'd call that-- it looks like two iambs, a pyrrhic, and three trochees, aka a big mess! X-D regardless, it's fun to talk about the stuff from with book, I'm really enjoying it as well! <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_smile.gif" title=":)" class="bb_smilies" /> owentheeditor on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-161833 Wed, 08 Jul 2009 17:29:55 +0000 owentheeditor 161833@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ Am I being a total tool? And like the flowers beside them, chill and shiver Robert Frost: Spring Pools is this not iambic hexameter rather than a weak ended pentameter? or is "flowers" actually "flours" and my head's northern dialect making a mountain out of a "wer" molehill? Loving the book but niggled by this miscreant. Help! exoskeleton on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-146321 Tue, 26 May 2009 02:02:34 +0000 exoskeleton 146321@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ I am not going to read this whole thread (yet) but I have just begun this book and I am surprised be how enthusiastic I find myself! I have never been set against poetry but I this book is already making me really excited to learn. it reminds me of the book <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Thank-You-Arguing-Aristotle-Persuasion/dp/0307341445">Thank You For Arguing</a> which was extremely enjoyable to read and continues to help me in both writing and living. anabelle on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-112199 Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:38:32 +0000 anabelle 112199@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ As Simon Critchley says "poetry is life with the ray of imagination's power shot through it." Imagination needs to be set free not tied to verse forms. The more time you spend on form the less you will have to say, come to form after many many years of finding yourself having to write down what is burning inside of you. Utilise a technique that may aid the expressive power of your thought, but please, please, please, just write. Don't let form and the history of the poem block your access to the subconscious. Poetry is liberating, life affirming, it is not an academic exercise. Drown in words and thoughts, express yourself. Read the greatest thinkers; understand philosophers, watch great cinema, look at great art, listen to great music. Then you will start to build the muscles of imagination. Look at the paintings of Francis Bacon, watch Tarkovsky's cinema, you will understand just from those two artists enough about destroying figurative representation and going beyond what each medium intrinsically inhibts. Poetry is this, it is not part of academia! Form will destroy you, be very very careful to use it, never ever let it become your master. Poetry is taught as something other than it is, and hence why the greatest of all art forms is the least understood and more sadly least enjoyed by the general public. Art teachers aren't great painters. Throw your words across the paper, communicate from your heart. listen and watch all life, connect with all things, there is poetry. It is as free as nature itself it is the heart of us all and it is beautiful. amberzak on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-99211 Sat, 17 Jan 2009 13:11:21 +0000 amberzak 99211@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ I love this book. I keep trying to get my University to put it on the reading list, as we do creative writing and genre, poetry, and everything we learn is in this book Rain Dog on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-98923 Fri, 16 Jan 2009 22:22:45 +0000 Rain Dog 98923@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ I got the book some time ago and started to read it, carrying a notebook with me to do all the exercises. <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":D" class="bb_smilies" /> I think it's a fantastic book and hopefully all the things I learn from it will be of use during my university studies (I just started my English studies last autumn). Actually I was already familiar with some of the terminology since I took an Introduction to Literary Studies course in my first term and had to analyse some poems. This book would definitely be great as a part of a course on poetry. I'm doing one such course next year and I intend to use Ode Less Travelled as my guide. I'm already having so much fun with it. <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_wink.gif" title=";-)" class="bb_smilies" /> PamJH on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-96529 Thu, 08 Jan 2009 03:35:34 +0000 PamJH 96529@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ I just bought this book on ebay. I can't wait to read it. fryfan20 on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-68084 Wed, 13 Aug 2008 14:04:40 +0000 fryfan20 68084@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ i have start reading it, am not very far yet but i find it a bit difficult. i know Stephen is a 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times smarter then my but mostly he has no problem coming down to my level of understanding (without making me feel very stupid). maybe i just have to get use to the words that are used and i am not giving up. <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_smile.gif" title=":)" class="bb_smilies" /> fryfan20 on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-67244 Fri, 18 Jul 2008 16:30:06 +0000 fryfan20 67244@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ good news, i just read a email from the site where i ordered the book and they have done it on the mail so it should be here Friday or Saturday so i can (if nothing goes wrong) take it with me on vacation <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> </blockquote> I hope you got the book in time and - fryfan20 - don't forget a pencil and a notebook, as Stephen friendly asks you to do some exercises <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_smile.gif" title=":)" class="bb_smilies" /> </blockquote> it's here it's here it's here ! so i think it is clear, i'm very happy with that <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":D" class="bb_smilies" /> i will take with my a pencil and notebook (set it on my list) <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":D" class="bb_smilies" /> ladyfromhamburg on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-67237 Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:04:22 +0000 ladyfromhamburg 67237@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ good news, i just read a email from the site where i ordered the book and they have done it on the mail so it should be here Friday or Saturday so i can (if nothing goes wrong) take it with me on vacation <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> </blockquote> I hope you got the book in time and - fryfan20 - don't forget a pencil and a notebook, as Stephen friendly asks you to do some exercises <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_smile.gif" title=":)" class="bb_smilies" /> fryfan20 on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-67211 Thu, 17 Jul 2008 23:01:49 +0000 fryfan20 67211@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ good news, i just read a email from the site where i ordered the book and they have done it on the mail so it should be here Friday or Saturday so i can (if nothing goes wrong) take it with me on vacation <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> fryfan20 on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-67152 Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:05:57 +0000 fryfan20 67152@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ i have ordered the book (because the book stores have to order it to so i can just as well do it myself) and now I have to wait and I hate waiting especially for books. I want it now ! i hope it comes before my vacation (so before Sunday) so i can take it with my. i am not such a big fan of poetry because must of the time i don't understand it. i hope that Stephen can explain it to my (if he can't make my understand nobody can). so i am waiting and waiting and.............................................. Gertrude Susanne on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-67066 Sun, 13 Jul 2008 11:11:13 +0000 Gertrude Susanne 67066@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_eek.gif" title="8-O" class="bb_smilies" /> *munches purging biscuits* <img src="http://www.ecards4u.de/emo/extra/wc.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> This reminds me of my friend's former English teacher, who must be the most inept philologist ever. According to her, 'pensioner' is not to be translated with 'Pensionär' or 'Rentner', but, brace yourself, with 'Ausscheidender aus einem Arbeitsverhältnis'. Dear God in heaven.</blockquote> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_eek.gif" title="8-O" class="bb_smilies" /> We call them "Pensionisten" <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_wink.gif" title=";-)" class="bb_smilies" /> Soupy Twist on "The Ode Less Travelled" http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/topic/the-ode-less-travelled#post-66905 Thu, 10 Jul 2008 20:37:43 +0000 Soupy Twist 66905@http://www.stephenfry.com/forum/ Sadly, some translations leave a lot to be desired (I was once told that "digestives" had someplace been rendered as "verdauungsfördernde Kekse" <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_eek.gif" title="8-O" class="bb_smilies" /> )</blockquote> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_eek.gif" title="8-O" class="bb_smilies" /> *munches purging biscuits* <img src="http://www.ecards4u.de/emo/extra/wc.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.stephenfry.com/bb-content/plugins//bb-smilies/default/icon_biggrin.gif" title=":-D" class="bb_smilies" /> This reminds me of my friend's former English teacher, who must be the most inept philologist ever. According to her, 'pensioner' is not to be translated with 'Pensionär' or 'Rentner', but, brace yourself, with 'Ausscheidender aus einem Arbeitsverhältnis'. Dear God in heaven.