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Chameleon


Member

Posted Sat Feb 27th, 2010 12:04pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

There is no me. I blend in. When I sit on a leaf, I’m green, when I sit on a twig, I’m brown, and when I sit on a parrot, I get thrown off. The leaf thinks I’m green and the twig thinks I’m brown. I just wonder why everyone has these weird pictures of me. I’m invisible. It’s better that way, because a visible chameleon is food.

I’m not a chameleon, though, I’m depressed. But that’s just what I think, and what do I know? I went to see a psychologist, who said that she can see that I feel this and that and something else, I don’t recall the exact words, and that I can call that depressed, if I like. Interestingly, that was a while after she told me I could see a psychiatrist or my gp about antidepressants, if I liked, which is something she said very soon, not long after reading „depression“ on my referal. Maybe depressed people would generally be better, if they just did whatever they liked. Like kill themselves. (belated sarcasm warning).

In mid-second session she said that she isn’t there to tell me what to do. I hadn’t asked her what to do. I thought I had just expected that she did her job, because I don’t have to see a psychologist to be allowed to call things whatever I like and do whatever I want. I have to see a psychologist, because I want to know what the problem is and what I can do about it. Maybe she thought there’s a risk that I’d just do whatever she says, well, good luck with trying to make me do something that way, I am not my mother.
My mother is ill. Last week she had a chance of surviving the next five years of 15-30%. She didn’t listen to the doctor carefully enough to figure that out, because she doesn’t really want to know. She’s the one who asks questions that go: „doctor, if I were you’re mother, would you recommend...“ She also told him, that her gp and the other doctor both said she should have that therapy, because they think she’s strong enough, to which the doctor just said: „Well, and I let you decide.“ I liked that. Of course, she asked me what I think, next. I said I’m not yet informed enough to have an opinion.

That’s a phrase that makes sense to me, quite unlike „call it depressed if you like“. I can call it Henry if I like, but what’s the point? If you don’t want it to be understood as a diagnosis, why not say: I don’t want this to be understood as a diagnosis. IF that’s what she meant. It makes me angry that I try to accept that I have a „normal“ problem and qualified people talk to me like, „no, actually mental health is a voodoo thing. It’s essential that we dance around the table before we drink the chicken blood.“ The first person I saw about it apologised that people have to wait in the corridor, where everyone can see them. Hello? Did my therapist just expect me to be ashamed or what? The second person I saw was the one who had listened very carefully in the lesson that taught to be completely undefined. Ergo, I have something so shameful that nobody even dares to define it. No, seriously, that was a joke.

Anyway, they had another test and found out that my mother was lucky enough to have a mild subtype (at a 5% chance), so it’s now unlikely that she’s going to die. Well, now that it isn’t unlikely anymore, that it would be unlikely, its unlikely she’ll die. And what could possibly go wrong, when you’re on arsenic? If I concentrate very hard, I think that I’m relieved, but without focussing at all it’s apparent that I also feel like shit. I have completely lost meaning.

Mid-second session is also when I was finished with mentioning everything that’s shit in my life in a summary kind of way. Sometimes, one hour and thirty minutes is all the time you get to come up with something. Like a question. I quite like questions. What she came up with, I guess, is that she could be quiet and wait if it makes me say more, because that’s what she concluded, wrongly, at the end of the first session when I was already on the way out, that: „she made me tell her somewhat more towards the end“. Fatal misapprehension of how proud I was that I fitted two thirds of my problems into one hour, even providing structure and climax, while being busy crying my eyes out and keeping my voice steady. I was fucking brilliant and she thought that was her achievement? Sure, being quiet might work with people who are not the queen of silence. All that silence does, is to convince me that I’m wasting my time.
30 minutes left to say nothing much, start asking questions about alternatives, medications and duration, and being told that it’s going to take an indefinite amount of time to find windows and turn off the heating instead of closing the blinds. There is no way of doing it faster or different and behavioural therapy isn’t for me, because my problem isn’t that I have to be told how to make lists.

I don’t think I can provide windows. I was more under the impression that I’m naked on a hill in a thunderstorm wearing a copper helmet and shouting: THERE IS NO GOD. There isn’t any kind of window within a radius of two miles, so where would I get a window from and what for? To hold it over my head? I think I know what she meant, but what she said was that my whole life story isn’t even good enough to have a window in it. Well, if there is nothing more I can tell her, and there’s nothing more she can tell me, that’s the point where conversations naturally end, or not? I can’t shake off the impression that people try to find a way around my brain and that might then be their window to my rotting emotions. There is no way around my brain, though.

I see too much. I see bad moves a lot. I have big eyes that move independent of each other. If I didn’t see bad moves, I’d be food.
It’s a bad move to use something I mentioned in one sentence, as an argument against another form of therapy, when you didn’t even make sure you got me right, because that way, the argument will fall apart and open the view on how you just tried to convince me of your view by making up rubbish arguments. So behavioural therapy isn’t for me, because I didn’t get on with the university corridor person who told me to google a therapist, which didn’t help me one bit? That’s not an argument against behavioural therapy, that’s a joke. A completely unnecessary one, as she’d already explained her opinion differently, but maybe thought I didn’t react convinced enough. After all, when I asked her, if she could recommend a behavioural therapist, all SHE came up with was that I could look in the yellow pages, where sometimes it’s mentioned which style therapists are. I checked - it isn’t.
Doesn’t make her view wrong necessarily, I know that, didn’t make me want to come back either. I had let the corridor person into a discussion about the different therapy „styles“ and he told me they really don’t like each other. Seems he was right about that.

The experience made me hate people more. It’s not advisable to hate people more, when you already hated people, if you ask me. My plan was to go see a psychiatrist instead and medicate it away, because people are obviously too stupid to help me. No offence. Well, it probably is an offence, but if you’re offended it just prooves that people are stupid, somehow. But now, I don’t want to talk about the same things all over again. It seems pointless. Maybe that would make me a better client, because if I don’t talk, then at least it makes sense to look for a window. And I can let tiny bits of information slip and they could congratulate themselves for their extreme cleverness that enabled them to achieve that. Maybe I’ll try to play treasure hunt next time I see a therapist, they might be of more use, once I made them feel good about their detective skills. It does work a bit like a treasure hunt in „In treatment“ I have noticed, which is due to the need for dramatic effect, I hope. You know what Paul would say? He’d say it’s interesting how I’ve been mixing stories of my mother and my therapist, especially since it’s months between them, and that I describe it like they both lack understanding and that I seem to be angry and feel powerless.

I have no idea what I’m doing anymore.
I know where the two stories connect. I feel miserable because of one and I’ve already felt rather miserable before, and there is nothing I can do about it because of the other. I tried, it was pointless, I’m angry, I hate people, I can't go back there. Yeah, it would be easier to get help, if I didn’t hate people for being such stupid idiots, wouldn’t it? What do I do now? Whatever I do, I’ll do it alone, as always, and as it’s unlikely that it’ll kill me, well, what do I actually complain about?
I’m angry and that’s difficult, because I’ve learned that it means „I’m an insensitive, ignorant, stupid, blathering berserk who runs Amok, hurts everyone and blames the telly“ from the alcoholic paternal side. I don’t know how to be angry properly, so I put it here just so that I am officially angry. I couldn’t tell you what the point of that is, but it feels like there is one. I got a car insurance bill for christmas from my father. Maybe I’m actually not angry.

I feel betrayed by the pictures some people have of me and I’d like to turn into green slime and jump into their faces for that. But that would probably involve talking and I don’t see how that’s worth it. Unnecessary to say that I don’t trust anyone much. I think it’s impossible to help me, I don’t want to see anyone about anything, I haven’t worked much for three weeks, though I have a deadline that says „if you work 14 hours a day, you’ll only be two months late.“ When I saw the psychologist I didn’t work properly for two weeks, because I had appointment anxiety, and all she said was that I couldn’t expect anything to be different till way past my deadline, which happens to be the time I’ll have to move places and get a job, if I’m halfways sane at that point, so sure, I could start therapy and then break it off, so that I gain „therapy experience“. How is that good enough? Somehow I don’t believe in „therapy experience“, I believe in „traumatic therapy break off“. I can’t get help on cost of work, because work is the only reference frame I have left, it actually helps me, and I don’t want to get drugs anymore, because I don’t want to talk to people. Well, my mother isn’t dying, so I should get back to work somehow. Not sure how, given that I don’t want to think about it. I should find back to my calendar and make a list. It must work, simply because there isn’t another option. I’m not sure I’ve ever felt so fucked in my life and I’m getting too old to believe that it’ll be better one day.

I’ve been editing for a couple of days, I could probably go on editing for weeks. I think it sounds like I’m inconsiderate, when being considerate is all I ever do and I’m really tired of it, so I won’t go on editing for a couple of weeks. I want others to be considerate for a change. And it doesn’t cover what I’m angry about the most. I don’t know if I could express it, if I hadn’t been asked not to talk about it, though I doubt anything I say can stop people having the wrong image of me. It’s more likely they’d just smirk and say: Haha.. that isn’t you, look here, in this picture, THAT is you.. thought you could fool me, ey?“ And then I’m just more invisible.

And now, I’ll change that. Not sure if being more inconsiderate is such a good idea, but... did I just say that? I meant being more inconsiderate is a fantastic idea, of course. Alternatively I might be losing my mind. Who knows.


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Nitro


Member

Posted Fri Mar 5th, 2010 5:46pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

"no, actually mental health is a voodoo thing. It’s essential that we dance around the table before we drink the chicken blood.“ "

That particular piece of your post jumped out and made me laugh my ass off, whatever your intent at the time may have been. It sums up, for me, what I think of most therapy/therapists.

So how are you doing lately chameleon?

Really? Wow.

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katysara


Moderator

Posted Fri Mar 5th, 2010 11:32pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

Wow that took some reading especially as i've taken my meds and am 1/2 asleep. Spotted the Terry Pratchett quote rehashed about the copper helmet in the rain shouting there is no god. A favourite of mine.

I'm struggling to keep eyes focused. Behavioural therapy may not be for you, have you considered any of the more psychoanalytical types of therapy... psychoanalysis, psychodynamic? Look them up.

How are you doing now?

KSx

I am an administrator on this site.

"Having a great intellect is no path to being happy."
~ Stephen Fry

See my website: www.katysaraculling.com

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judasishmael


Member

Posted Sat Mar 6th, 2010 9:13am Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

My shrink quit me, but not before I offered him the meat of my problems and all he asked me was, after some hemming and hawwing, how my relationship with my sister was. The meat never mentioned my sister, so who cares?
While I am against the shrink I had, his is not the tutalage that all have followed, thus, I would reccommend seeking out a psychologist that meets your needs.
As far as the picture that people seem to have of you, I was in a group that liked me until I felt bad and after a few times of excusing mysylf to sit in the car, they all decided I was crazy and wrote me off as such. I was an outcast among so-called friends. When there were get-togethers, I was alwys the strange one, the crazy one. But, through years of living away from that prejudice, I have found that I AM NOT CRAZY. I found that I was just feeling and experiencing things that THEY did not even want to care about. Apparently others were not as sad as I was. I found this both strange and heartening. Then I found people who felt as sad as I did, but worked through it and they gave me strenghth and hope.
Whatever you're feeling, if you feel the need to be inconsiderate, if your being honest...we may not be able to even make you feel better, but we are here to more than listen, but to understand.
You are obviously feeling many bad things right now, but those are the very same feelings I and we have had and it is a good thing you came to this site becasue, even though I am new here, it seems like a tight knit group to which you can belong so you choose.

The "flaws" that move us to hurt move us also to share our pain with others, thereby making others feel less alone and, thereby, becoming a vital link in a chain reaction of, subtle though it may seem, healing.

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katysara


Moderator

Posted Sat Mar 6th, 2010 5:44pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

you are quite welcome here, i say that as a user, mod and an administrator.

KSx

I am an administrator on this site.

"Having a great intellect is no path to being happy."
~ Stephen Fry

See my website: www.katysaraculling.com

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Chameleon


Member

Posted Sun Mar 14th, 2010 3:48pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

Thank you for your replies.
I’m finding it difficult to write anything now, keep losing myself in detail and then think: what does it matter. I suppose it should matter to me, and it does, but at the same time it doesn’t, and I’m unwilling to let anything matter.
Like I’ve just learned that my mother has been out of hospital for at least three days from a message on my phone by her, basically complaining that I haven’t called. Well, I have tried to call her. In hospital. Where I expected her to be. Because I’m not psychic. Just a little detail.
I would usually get more worked up about that, but now I’m so used to it, it would be silly to expect anything else.


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Chameleon


Member

Posted Wed Mar 17th, 2010 11:57am Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

Great. I went home to structure my work. Now I sit here crying, because it would be so much easier to die. There’s a reason I can’t often look at all my work and unfortunately that’s necessary when you’re supposed to write about it.
„You have to look at everything in therapy.“ What? How does that relate to what I’ve just said? Firstly, I’m not going to give you the full details of my working schedule, because that’s completely irrelevant. Secondly, ignoring certain circumstances is a symptom, not something I am free to stop doing, so that I can have therapy. I’ve looked that up, because that comment freaked me out, and YOU are the one who’s supposed to already know that, ffs, not ME. Thirdly, I begin to feel blamed for your window finding difficulties. Forthly, no, saying „you have to ENGAGE in therapy“ in an emphatic way doesn’t really change that at all. I’ve spent months to manage to come here and then I spent hours telling you everything I could think of, so who the fuck isn’t engaging enough? I’m not here to tell a grown-up person what to do, you know.
Is what I should have said.
Unfortunately, I wouldn’t.
Would almost be like engaging in therapy, if I did, ey?
Wouldn’t be much left to have therapy for, if I did.
She might just have meant to say that therapy is difficult and there’s no easy answers. Not that I see why you’d have to tell me that. I’m not giving an unsatisfied impression, because I haven’t yet realised that things are difficult. I’m giving an unsatisfied impression, because I’ve been talking about everything for hours, just to be told that I have to look at everything. You simply can’t be serious.
Or it was a reflex. „’Look at all of it’... oh, wait... there is a something I can say about that..yay.. it’s universal.. and clever and ..yeah, let’s just say: you have to look at everything in therapy. Ha, she can’t possibly use that against me.“
Well.

This is how you stop looking at work when it’s getting too difficult: Look at something else to lift your mood. Like how angry you are at people.
I feel let down a lot. Might be transference or might be that people let me down a lot. Might be that I’m letting people down a lot. Might be that I’ll be the worst imaginable patient once I’ve looked up everything I come across in Wikipedia.


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Nitro


Member

Posted Wed Mar 17th, 2010 7:19pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

Sorry you're having such a tough time of it. Sounds like you're pretty dissatisfied with the whole therapy thing.

Maybe that's the first part of entering into the whole process. The frustration with few absolutes and tons of "Might be.."'s.

At the end of the day, I think there's a truth that if you never showed up to that persons office again..they'd think about it for about ten minutes. I don't mean that to sound 'mean' or anything. 'Therapist' is a job. Not everyone is really terrific at their jobs. But, no matter how you see...I'd gamble very few would be willing to be suddenly brilliant. I think they try to see how committed a person is to *continuing* therapy, not just starting it even if starting it meant you had to work yourself up to that. They may wonder,"Is this person in it for the long haul? If they come even slightly undone, do they have a good enough social support around them to 'handle' it till the next session?...etc etc etc "

Try to endure it for a while longer than it took you to work yourself up to it or something along those lines and accept, when and as you can, that it's going to be rough going sometimes. Otherwise, I think you'd just cheat yourself...but if at some point you think you just cannot respect who's working along with you, find someone else...

Really? Wow.

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katysara


Moderator

Posted Thu Mar 18th, 2010 12:47pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

well said

I am an administrator on this site.

"Having a great intellect is no path to being happy."
~ Stephen Fry

See my website: www.katysaraculling.com

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greentree


Member

Posted Thu Mar 18th, 2010 8:23pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

Therapy is hard work. Bloody hard work.
You do have to engage to a certain extent, but not necessarily right away. Am currently seeing two therapists (due to an NHS mix up and in the meantime me finding someone private), and though the private woman is WAY easier to get on with than the NHS woman, I have had to say to both of them that a large part of me does not want to be there.
In my logical head, i 'know' i need to sort stuff out, otherwise it will come back and bite me on the butt at some point. The other part of me really HATES talking about myself, doesn't see the point, etc etc. But being honest helps (or i find it did). Decent therapist won't take it personally and then will at least now what they're dealing with, and what the barriers are.

As Nitro said, it is hard work, but if you're really not getting on with the person, find another. You need someone you can relate to and get on with (as much as you can with a therapist), and if it's not working out with one, try another.

No sig.

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katysara


Moderator

Posted Thu Mar 18th, 2010 11:14pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

If you are finding therapy hard you can be pretty sure it's working. And it's true what they say, it gets worse at first before it gets better. But it is so worthwhile.

ksx

I am an administrator on this site.

"Having a great intellect is no path to being happy."
~ Stephen Fry

See my website: www.katysaraculling.com

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Chameleon


Member

Posted Fri Mar 19th, 2010 6:21pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

I wonder what people are supposed to do, once they've figured out that they're not good enough for therapy.


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katysara


Moderator

Posted Fri Mar 19th, 2010 7:46pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

Well that recently happened to me - sort of. I'd been having therapy regularly with a great chap but he left and (eventually) I was passed on to someone else. She basically said there was nothing she could do for me and kicked me out. (not literally)

So now I no longer have therapy.

My cpn resigned at the same time and i'm still waiting for a new one of those.

KSx

I am an administrator on this site.

"Having a great intellect is no path to being happy."
~ Stephen Fry

See my website: www.katysaraculling.com

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Chameleon


Member

Posted Sat Mar 27th, 2010 11:24am Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

I never actually had therapy. I had „we’ll see if therapy can do anything for you and whether I can work with you and see if you can work with me“, but she said something like therapy would be much the same.
I think I decided about the question much faster than her, because she said she didn’t want to send me away. That was however very late and I actually thought she was desinterested, careless and manipulative, which is somewhat worse than just feeling send away.
I knew it would take long to get my trust back to even zero, I knew it would probably be easier to see someone else, who would ideally also be capable of prescribing drugs. And that’s what I told her, that I don’t want another appointment and will go to see a psychiatrist.
I make good theoretical plans. I thought it nice to give her the plan, so she would let me go, but had a bad feeling that it would look very different when put into practice, because it HAD taken me about two years from deciding to see a therapist to actually seeing a proper therapist. So chances are, that a plan of starting at zero with the thought that it’s all pointless and just makes things worse and it’s going to be the same again, because it might really be my fault, and drugs don’t necessarily work and then I’ll be ready to kill myself, is not exactly easier. Well, whatever, at least I have a plan. What I don’t have anymore is time.


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katysara


Moderator

Posted Sun Mar 28th, 2010 6:25pm Post subject: And what about me? (contains hate and.. whatever)

What exactly do you mean because that reads like you have no time left before you kill yourself which is obviously not what any of us want. You say you have a plan... is that for life or death.

I have trust issues too. But i am learning to give people a chance and am like an elephant when it comes to second chances - i never forget. Somethings I will give a 2nd chance, many i wont.

ksx

I am an administrator on this site.

"Having a great intellect is no path to being happy."
~ Stephen Fry

See my website: www.katysaraculling.com

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