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CollectorManiac


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 4:55pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
Yeah, with a political culture like ours, after we've been gunless for so long, guns would just be snatched up by the extremists and left alone by the rational people who they're purposed to help
So guns, they seem a nono
And the BNP aren't religious, though they did mount an ad campaign suggesting jesus would vote for them, they are nonehteless racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-semitic holocaust deniers. So heaps of fun, naturally.

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Stoopiduk


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 5:02pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
Hmmm... perhaps the BNP should link arms with the cathlic church?

All joking aside, they're a menace for all the reasons tango listed and a few more to boot. They pray on the ignorant and the whip them into a racist frenzy in a basic "they're taking our jobs" kind of way. They are a roadblock to a peaceful and prosperous country and indeed Europe.

I still firmly believe they have a right to exist, but that their membership could be reduced drastically with some old fashioned eye opening.

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Peachy Keenan


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 5:19pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
I'll probably be in the minority here, but yes, I'm siding with Stoopiduk too. Fear is only generated by what we don't know and the only way to prevent fear is knowledge. I believe there are those out there who think they know enough already, especially those who claim their prejudices are based on their own experiences and what they "feel", rather than the actual facts. Thus, they are not willing to learn and continue to hate. I have to ask, what kind of a life is that? I'm stumpted
And political parties like the BNP have their equivilents here in Australia too - One Nation is a most recent example but the worst part is their leader Pauline Hanson actually managed to win a federal seat many moons ago. She didn't last long however but that doesn't mean she hasn't stayed in the public eye. I find her rather loathesome and has become something of a joke nowdays but when she was in the spotlight, she encompassed everything that was bad about racism in politics.
As it has been said, if people knew what these parties actually stood for and who they represent, then would they actually vote for them? And when these so-called politicians and party leaders try to demostrate they are really the ones taking action, do people understand that they have a deeper agenda? If democracy has taught me one thing, it's don't just vote to keep the best party in but to keep the worst party out. I'm quite glad One Nation, the APP and other nationalist parties are not holding seats because there is not many out there who'd vote for them. That kinda renews my faith in humanity a bit.
And I also believe it is one thing to complain about such a political party but if you want to fight the fire, you have to do it in such a way that it won't make you look like you're coming off second best. You have to deal with the source of the problem and ask "how can we better ourselves?" without bending the system or preaching.

Twittering @peachykeenan!

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CollectorManiac


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 6:15pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
I certainly don't expect you to be in the minority, I for one agree, lashing out won't solve anything, getting the truth out is the best way to do it and is the way the democratic process should work in the first place

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Stoopiduk


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 7:04pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
I think I'm going to rather like this place.

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CollectorManiac


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 9:46pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
Excellentay

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MoonLightSpiral


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 10:18pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
Hey, don't know if we're still posting in this convo, but i'll shoot anyways.
I'm too young to vote, and usually if I speak politics, i'll be laughed at.

Anyways, I can't help but wonder who would be sick enough to vote the BNP.
No matter how much the economy is failing, or being are getting sick of Labour ect.. I dont understand why any British person would want to vote in a 'Nazi-like' government, and scapegoat against immigrant and such.
Sorry if this doesn't make sense, but I personally was born in the UK, however my mother and father were not, they both have good jobs as they are well educated.
Still apologies if this makes no sense to any one, I can get really angry/heavily opinionated on these topics.

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ShaylaMorris


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 10:46pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
Hey, don't know if we're still posting in this convo, but i'll shoot anyways.
I'm too young to vote, and usually if I speak politics, i'll be laughed at.

Anyways, I can't help but wonder who would be sick enough to vote the BNP.
No matter how much the economy is failing, or being are getting sick of Labour ect.. I dont understand why any British person would want to vote in a 'Nazi-like' government, and scapegoat against immigrant and such.
Sorry if this doesn't make sense, but I personally was born in the UK, however my mother and father were not, they both have good jobs as they are well educated.
Still apologies if this makes no sense to any one, I can get really angry/heavily opinionated on these topics.

You will not be laughed at here just take your time to express yourself. Your'e doing fine.

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CollectorManiac


Member

Posted Tue May 26th, 2009 11:08pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
The thing is, they're very good at hiding their neo-Nazi roots, so people just don't know what they really stand for
My best friends older sister voted for them a few years ago just because they had 'British' in the name, she'd never heard of them before, and it's that kind of stupid behaviour that gets people voting for them
Some people genuinely are that racist and sexist and generally biggotted, but most are just dissillusioned with mainstream politics or are scared by their situation, and the BNP offer them a way out, without any explanation as to what they'll actually do, just that they'll 'do it better than Labour' or whatever
I just saw their second Party Political Broadcast (while I was eating my tea, I sat down, turned on the box and their was Griffin's face, I nearly launched my plate) and he's wrapping himself up in Winston Churchill, making it out that he's on the side of the war heroes, just another way of playing on what people are proud of in Britain
The bit that wound me up most was "Many Britons have worked, fought and died for us", well yes they have, but against fascist scum like the BNP

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Nitro


Member

Posted Wed May 27th, 2009 4:10am Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
I'm not sure being armed to the teeth is really the answer to any of our nation's problems. I personally think tight gun laws are a fantastic thing in this country, and the whole world could benefit from a similar arrangement.
I respect what you're trying to say about it making us easier to rule, but I would not feel any more secure with a gun in my hand.

Last I heard from a friend, crime had gone up over 70% in London since more recent tightening of gun laws.

What the average person, even undecided on lawful ownership, tends not to take into account is that criminals do not obey gun laws, nor most laws for that matter. That's why they're called criminals X-D The only people gun laws affect are those who ARE willing to follow the laws. Disarm the responsible, and only the government and the criminals are armed. If you're comftorable with that, so be it. For my part, I think it's a terrifying type of passivism. ( no offense )

Really? Wow.

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Stoopiduk


Member

Posted Wed May 27th, 2009 10:08am Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
A quick peak at the chart and table might just show why I'm happy to leave the guns in the hands of trained officers, soldiers and the like. Sure criminals have guns, but it's a damn sight harder for them to get hold of them here than across the pond.

I've heard the rhetoric from American pro-arm groups and find all of their logic flawed, I doubt many other people in this forum are going to be pro-gun. I'd take a 70% rise nationally on our stats over a 5% rise on America's, just for the sake of stopping people being gunned down.

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF01.htm
Check these figures, or any others you might find on the internet, then add up the value of the lives of those killed in your country by guns, and balance it against the value of your poorly written constitution.

Back to the BNP bit - I believe the people that vote for them are, for the most part, misguided angry people. It's easy to blame people that aren't like you; find a group of people with a common difference to you and then blame them for your problems. It's easy to single someone out with darker skin or a foreign accent.

There will always be those well beyond redemption that hate foreigners or black people cimply because they themselves are seriously flawed.

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Nitro


Member

Posted Wed May 27th, 2009 5:19pm Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
A quick peak at the chart and table might just show why I'm happy to leave the guns in the hands of trained officers, soldiers and the like. Sure criminals have guns, but it's a damn sight harder for them to get hold of them here than across the pond.

I've heard the rhetoric from American pro-arm groups and find all of their logic flawed, I doubt many other people in this forum are going to be pro-gun. I'd take a 70% rise nationally on our stats over a 5% rise on America's, just for the sake of stopping people being gunned down.

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF01.htm
Check these figures, or any others you might find on the internet, then add up the value of the lives of those killed in your country by guns, and balance it against the value of your poorly written constitution.



I don't want to take this thread off track, so maybe we can discuss this elsewhere. I'll go create a new topic so everyone can pound me X-D But I will say one thing since you provided it: I'd hardly expect a site called "Gun Control Network" to offer unbiased stats. X-D BTW, I could care less if most of the people here aren't 'pro-gun'. I don't hold nor form my opinions on popular vote or being popular. If you think most people in this country, for instance, hold guns in their households, you're wrong...but twenty years of gang violence in Compton, California went on IN SPITE OF increasing strictions on gun laws because law breakers do NOT obey gun laws ).

Really? Wow.

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TobiasMonk


Moderator

Posted Thu May 28th, 2009 3:19am Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF01.htm
Check these figures, or any others you might find on the internet, then add up the value of the lives of those killed in your country by guns, and balance it against the value of your poorly written constitution.

Because one disagrees with a document it doesn't mean that the document is poorly written, it simply means one has an opinion, an opinion which frankly could have been expressed better....with less ignorance and more tact. The US Constitution may be flawed, with obvious signs of a different era, and amendments in need of amending, but at least we had the stones to put to the ink to paper, which can't be said about the de-facto the UK Constitution.

I cannot be awake for nothing looks to me as it did before, Or else I am awake for the first time, and all before has been a mean sleep.
Walt Whitman

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joan


Member

Posted Thu May 28th, 2009 7:13am Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.
Back to the BNP: as mentioned before, we had our own version in the late 90s - Pauline Hanson and her 'One nation' party. She became the federal MP for my area, and the local polling booth in my suburb gave her the highest vote, so you can imagine my shame at this. Previously and since then, this was a strong Labour party area. I joint an anti-racist group to combat her influence.

Anyway, her local electoral office did NOTHING for the constituents - if you needed your MP for a federal matter you had to go to a local senator, or a neighbouring area MP. Hanson had no grasp of any issues, she just spouted her usual racist rubbish, which was very similar to BNP rubbish. Then a dozen or so of her followers got State seats 2 years later.

They were all so hopeless and divided among themselves that the whole thing imploded. They are dead as a dodo now - an almost forgotten shameful chapter in our political history.

I remember Hanson's last stand. She was going for a new federal seat and organised a rally in Ipswich, the city at the heart of her following. Skinheads were bussed in from the Gold Coast, and her supporters were there cheering her on.

We anti-racists gathered peacefully with our banners, while she shouted at us from the podium, spittle oozing from the side of her mouth, and her fingers, with bright red nail polish, pointing at us as she ranted on, calling us dole-bludging scum etc. We were clearly far from that description: we looked like what we were, a bunch of academics, workers, teachers, church people, old people. Aborigines, migrants, etc..

Anyway, as she got herself all worked up, and came out with some stuff that was clearly outrageous, we just started to laugh - it wasn't planned, we couldn't help it, but once we got started we couldn't stop. Everyone joined in - you could see that even some of her supporters wanted to....

She didn't get elected - never did again whatever she tried. She tried the Senate last time, where you can get in with quite a small percentage, but she failed.

I honestly think we laughed her out of politics.

Worth a thought with the BNP.

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Stoopiduk


Member

Posted Thu May 28th, 2009 9:55am Post subject: DON'T vote BNP. There is no excuse.

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF01.htm
Check these figures, or any others you might find on the internet, then add up the value of the lives of those killed in your country by guns, and balance it against the value of your poorly written constitution.

Because one disagrees with a document it doesn't mean that the document is poorly written, it simply means one has an opinion, an opinion which frankly could have been expressed better....with less ignorance and more tact. The US Constitution may be flawed, with obvious signs of a different era, and amendments in need of amending, but at least we had the stones to put to the ink to paper, which can't be said about the de-facto the UK Constitution.

My apologies, I didn't express that in the best way at all. I think I'd drawn some silly simplistic line between the constitution arguement for gun ownership and the deaths of the victims of gun crime. Very poor form in any debate, sorry!

De-facto has its advantages - a constantly updated constitution rarely shows any signs of belonging to a different era, and is easily put right =)

BNP-wise I was rather annoyed to learn that there are no events in my local area (Colchester)

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