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Nitro


Member

Posted Wed Dec 16th, 2009 4:47pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

I found this to be a pretty intriguing article about the continued failure of Hollywood to trust women to do anything but look pretty, even in 'action' films with 'strong' female characters ( eye roll...really? look closer..)

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/13/movies/13dargis.html?_r=4&ref=movies

In a society where the president and the money bear the face of men, is it any wonder women have 'trust issues'? ( eye roll x 10 ). I'm growing really tired of men, particularly old, white men, insist that women have nothing left to be feminists for, nothing left to fight for as if equality arrived in 1974 and all has been well ever since. It's absurd, but then men aren't impacted by sexism the way women are ( we tend to see the payoffs vs the fines ) so of course so many think it's 'no big deal' and that women should 'just lighten up'.

Why do we men insist on proving over and over that we're stupid, fucking assholes?

Really? Wow.

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Sententia


Member

Posted Thu Dec 17th, 2009 5:03pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Old white men are holding on to how things used to be, and think they've done enough by entertaining what currently passes for equality between the sexes. Younger generations are going to be pushing things forward. Still, it will be a long time before any of it is truly equal. As you said, most men (and, I would add, women) seem to think there's nothing left to fight for.

In fact, many women avoid standing up for themselves because other people immediately give them the label of "feminist" and/or "bitch", which progresses to "man-hater". All of these are labels given by people who are not comfortable with a.) being a strong woman or b.) being a man around strong women.

I've digressed a bit...

The article is somewhat infuriating. On the one hand, it's terrible that there are so few female directors. I don't see why studios are overlooking an entire sex that could be contributing a wider variety of movies to an already redundant collection. On the other hand, it's sickening that popular women's movies are "New Moon" and "Sex and the City". We are doing nothing to improve our image as women by becoming obsessed with garbage that shows the extremes of female stereotypes.

To be honest, what upsets me the most is that women are thought to only like sappy, romantic, happy or lightly humorous movies - or, worse yet, that women don't like movies at all. I'm a woman, I love a good movie, and I don't like maudlin fluff. I'm sure many other women would agree with me.

In conclusion, men may be assholes, but too many women perpetuate the stereotype (or use it to their advantage). These things are never simple...

My twits: @avarwaen

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tito


Member *

Posted Fri Dec 18th, 2009 9:12pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Tito?

http://www.mediabistro.com/unbeige/original/50shousewife.jpg


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tito


Member *

Posted Fri Dec 18th, 2009 9:13pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Nah!!!!


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Sententia


Member

Posted Sat Dec 19th, 2009 1:36am Post subject: Man make, woman watch

I can't say what would be more accurate, as I don't yet know you, but this would be better!

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2201/1910183095_b5e6742257.jpg

My twits: @avarwaen

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tito


Member *

Posted Sat Dec 19th, 2009 12:49pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch


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Nitro


Member

Posted Tue Dec 29th, 2009 5:16am Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Another opp for discussion beyond fluff goes up in flames...

Really? Wow.

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Sententia


Member

Posted Tue Dec 29th, 2009 10:05pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Nitro said:
Another opp for discussion beyond fluff goes up in flames...

If you responded to my response it could be a proper discussion.

My twits: @avarwaen

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Nitro


Member

Posted Wed Dec 30th, 2009 3:11am Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Sorry Sententia.

"In fact, many women avoid standing up for themselves because other people immediately give them the label of "feminist" and/or "bitch", which progresses to "man-hater". All of these are labels given by people who are not comfortable with a.) being a strong woman or b.) being a man around strong women."

That's the crux of it, I think, even in context of the article. The majority of big producers are men and tend to, probably, gravitate to other 'big men' directors.

As for women buying into patriarchal nonsense, that IS a big part of the stalling of the progression of womens rights. There is a sort of *illusion* of equality that's been propagated but still, underneath the hood so to speak, women are still objectified and exploited. I'm sure the reasons for women going along with that are extremely complex and vary individual to individual.

I often hear, from both men and women, all females referred to in a group sense, as if women are not unique individuals apart from each other. This, imho, is a terrible social travesty.

Most men *secure* with their masculinity are not intimidated by strong, independent women.

I had a friend remark that feminists just want to be men. I really laid into him because that's one of the dumbest sorts of mentalities out there. In my opinion, women don't have to BE men but there's certainly nothing wrong with, and it might even help, women being AS SELFISH as men are raised to be. To think of themselves first, their own best interests first, and not be eroded by societal expectations. But society trains little girls to seek love, not respect. It's the reverse for males. So I think it's important that parents raise their daughters to expect respect for their individuality and humanity FIRST, and THEN consider Love.

Personally, I like discussions like this even though I might trip up myself in an attempt to explain or understand a thing. Men and women need to stop brushing each other with a broad stroke of the brush and making assumptions that 'all women are this way, think this way' and 'all men are x, y, and z'. I KNOW that women have a lot more to say about the world around them than what "Sex in the city" demonstrated ( shoes and dating ). I know this because my female friends are not all the same, do not all think the same, don't react the same, etc etc.

The one plus I'd give Sex In the City is that it tore the veil off the myth that women are non-sexual and only use sex to get love or money. In that series, the women clearly want sex for sex's sake and I've heard this same sentiment from women I've known. I do believe this is INCREDIBLY intimidating to many insecure men. It challenged the model of 'woman as pure mother-angel', which is probably some Virgin Mary hangover. Mary's body was a one-way street. Things could come out but nothing could go in, iow. Wouldn't an omnipotent God be the BEST lover if he's 'all knowing'? If so, then Mary probably had a very good time of it I hope so anyway lol

Really? Wow.

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tito


Member *

Posted Wed Dec 30th, 2009 3:53pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Ahem: Tito flounces in wearing a pink chiffon evening gown, false eyelashes and says, seductively..............I cannot do eet dahling!

(Nitro, I think you're the bee's knees, but just I can't stop myself)

I will wait by the door until a big strong man comes along to open it for me and then exit.

I'm going !!!!!!! Do not panic. Let the discussion continue!.


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Nitro


Member

Posted Wed Dec 30th, 2009 5:45pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Nitro stares down at the floor, shakes head, and says,"Tito...Tito...".

*heavy sigh* Dear, do I have to get the water hose again? At the very least, consider yourself sent to some other side of the forum - I would recommend General Scribblings, where you can let your creative streak run rampant and free - until you can behave yourself.

Really? Wow.

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tito


Member *

Posted Wed Dec 30th, 2009 6:22pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Thankyou for offering to turn a water hose on me. I appreciate it.

much love, Tito xxx


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Nitro


Member

Posted Thu Dec 31st, 2009 5:27am Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Well I didn't want you to LIKE IT Tito!! lol Terrific. Now the water hose won't work anymore on her.

Don't you worry young lady. I'll come up with someone else.

Now behave yourself. If you can't contribute to this discussion sans the comedic interruptions, then away with you!!

Really? Wow.

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tito


Member *

Posted Thu Dec 31st, 2009 2:01pm Post subject: Man make, woman watch

I am learning to be serious like you are.


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Nitro


Member

Posted Sun Jan 3rd, 2010 5:27am Post subject: Man make, woman watch

Yes, yes..very, very serious.

Seriously serious.

Damn it.

Really? Wow.

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