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ClareBear


Moderator

Posted Sat May 17th, 2008 12:59pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
MESHUGGAH!

For the uninitiated, here's "Bleed" from Obzen:

http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog......=394260566

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flookwit


Member

Posted Sat May 17th, 2008 2:56pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
[ Maybe you have to be in a certain mindset or something to get it.


I'm really interested in why certain music rocks with some people and bombs with others. Is it as simple as "mindset"? Or, perhaps as potentially complex as "mindset" depending on how you interpret "mindset".

I cannot understand how or why people listen to and get excited by stuff such as the brilliantly wicked band ClareBear left a link for. (Meshuggah? Obzen?). I listened and watched that link all the way through and I hated the visuals (apart from the cogs of the timepiece) couldn't hear the words being 'grouted' (can't say it sounded like singing, just a cross between loud grunting and shouting....can I invent a word called "grouting" that doesn't mean putting bathroom cement between tiles?) and finally, I thought the percussive accompaniment to the grouting sounded like a torrent of big, fat raindrops thundering on my garage's metal roof.

I really, really truly do not mean all the above as insulting or rude...I am GENUINELY curious. (I have a capacity to be genuinely curious that often seems to land me in a stooshie, and I never mean anything mean.....).

The reason for my curiosity? I love music and am interested in music making. I am going to be involved with teaching music at the 11 -17 year levels and I guess this sort of stuff is what many of them like. So, how the heck do I understand it? What is it with, say, ClareBear's good link, that appeals to people? What is that type of music, lyrics and stance about? Can anyone help me out here?

Of course, if nobody answers me, I suppose I could resort to analysing it in a purely academic way, and then in a psychological way, from my former professions, but I don't think I would 'get' it, as much as if some of you could err, um, explain to this child of the '60's.

Please, please, please, don't be mean to me; I wouldn't condemn anyone's choice of music, nor rubbish it. I just want to know a bit more.

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ClareBear


Moderator

Posted Sat May 17th, 2008 3:58pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
For band-based music to gel with me, the drummer's got to possess a godly amount of skill.

They lyrics, in case you missed them:

Beams of fire sweep thought my head
thrusts of pain increasingly engaged
sensory receptors succumb
i am no one now - only agony

my crimson liquid so frantically spilled
- the ruby fluid of life unleashed

ripples ascend to the surfaces of my eyes
their red pens drawing at random, at will
a myriad pains begotten in their wake
- the bastard spawn of a mutinous self

the regurgitation of my micro nemesis
- salivating red at the prospect of my ruin, my doom

malfunction the means for its ascent
bloodletting the stringent voice to beckon my soul
so futile any resisting tension
as death-induced mechanics propel its growth

the implement, the devices of my extinction
- the terminating clockwork of my gleeful bane
the definitive scourge of its mockery
- the end-art instruments lethality attained

heed- it commands, heed my will
bleed - it says, bleed you will

falling into the clarity of undoing
scornful gods haggle for my soul
minds eye flickers and vellicates as i let go
taunting whispers accompany my deletion

a sneering grin, the voice of my reaper
- chanting softly the song of depletion

I like something I can bellow along to, with incredible intensity. My musical taste has moved from pop, to heavier electronica and industrial...in 1998 (at 14) I stumbled across the work of Fear Factory (the Obsolete album) which blended the electronics with a lyrical vision comparable to what of Bladerunner or The Terminator, with some titanic tubwork from the educated feet (and hands) of one Raymond Herrera.

Variations on a theme, softer but no less intense: Opeth - Ghost Of Perdition ( http://songza.com/z/2hrhr1 ....10 mins long ) all the diversity in one song that most bands hope for over an album, or their careers.

Lyrics again:

Ghost of Mother
Lingering death
Ghost on Mother's bed
Black strands on the pillow
Contour of her health
Twisted face upon the head

Ghost of perdition
Stuck in her chest
A warning no one read
Tragic friendship
Called inside the fog
Pouring venom brew deceiving

Devil cracked the earthly shell
Foretold she was the one
Blew hope into the room and said:
"You have to live before you die young"

Holding her down
Channeling darkness
Hemlock for the Gods
Fading resistance
Draining the weakness
Penetrating inner light

Road into the dark unaware
Winding ever higher

Darkness by her side
Spoke and passed her by
Dedicated hunter
Waits to pull us under
Rose up to its call
In his arms she'd fall
Mother light received
And a faithfull servant's free

In time the hissing of her sanity
Faded out her voice and soiled her name
And like marked pages in a diary
Everything seemed clean that is unstained
The incoherent talk of ordinary days
Why would we really need to live?
Decide what is clear and what's within a haze
What you should take and what to give

Ghost of perdition
A saint's premonition's unclear
Keeper of holy hordes
Keeper of holy whores

To see a beloved son
In despair of what's to come

If one cut the source of the flow
And everything would change
Would conviction fall
In the shadow of the righteous
The phantasm of your mind
Might be calling you to go
Defying the forgotten morals
Where the victim is the prey

That'll do for now. More later.

Homework Assignment: seek out the song "Pixillate" by The Devin Townsend Band. 'Tis from the Synchestra album. Miles softer than the Opeth, in the same progressive vein....more clean vocals as opposed to the shouting (The Townsend has the best clean vocals I've heard)

Failing that, here's "Storm" from the album Accelerated Evolution. It's also the song that got me hooked on his stuff. http://hevydevy.com/audio/mp3/dtb_storm.mp3

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TobiasMonk


Moderator

Posted Sat May 17th, 2008 9:16pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
I'm really interested in why certain music rocks with some people and bombs with others. Is it as simple as "mindset"? Or, perhaps as potentially complex as "mindset" depending on how you interpret "mindset".

I'll listen to a lot of different stuff, but I always go back to the music I grew up listening to, which is the blues and some jazz. I'm not sure I know why, nostalgia or maybe because I've always been surrounded by it due to my locale. I think it's part of who we are as individuals. That doesn't answer your question, but there you go.

I cannot be awake for nothing looks to me as it did before, Or else I am awake for the first time, and all before has been a mean sleep.
Walt Whitman

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Sat May 17th, 2008 11:07pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
i'm trying to think of anything that really bombs with me...

1) recent top 40 "hiphop" that is a very very sad version of what it used to be

2) anything sung by meowing cats...i don't hate cats at all...just those stupid cat meow songs.

3).................


that song about picking ticks off your girlfriend.


because there are ticks in it.


if he was a good boyfriend he wouldn't have let her get ticks in the first place, and offered her some fucking bug repellent. but no, he wants to see her nekkid, so no bug repellent for you. INTENTIONAL!

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Roxy641


Member

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 1:33am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
Hi Mockingbird,

I love most types of music, although it would be easier to say which music I didn't like, but I don't like to be negitive, but could be if pressed

Wish I could play any musical instrument. Did attempt to learn the guitar many years ago, but I gave up quite quickly. I only own one i-pod, and that is nearly three years old.

Roxy641

because there doesn't seem to be a thread about music already which I am surprised about, music seems to be a big part of many people's lives.

What do you like? What do you hate (apart from the obvious stuff)? Do you play an instrument? Are you in a band/do you make music by yourself? How many ipods do you own?

etc etc...

"Life is too important to be taken seriously". OSCAR WILDE.

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flookwit


Member

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 8:03am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
For band-based music to gel with me, the drummer's got to possess a godly amount of skill.

Yep, agree there. Skill, and including a great sense of originality and improvisatory talent.


They lyrics, in case you missed them:

........
scornful gods haggle for my soul
minds eye flickers and vellicates as i let go
taunting whispers accompany my deletion

a sneering grin, the voice of my reaper
- chanting softly the song of depletion

Err, WTF is "vellicates" [sic] above ???

I like something I can bellow along to, with incredible intensity.

Yep, again, I can relate easily to that. It is perhaps why I am attracted to some very 'atypical-for-me' bands, and why I drive my partner to distraction, because I play and bellow out Manic Street Preachers at full volume or Bruce Cockburn's "A Dream Like Mine" ; they remind me of places (emotional and physical) I've been, friends I knew, emotions I sometimes lose touch with. For me, the power of these songs/music is so strong that I am transported back in time so I'm spaced out from the current day/hour/minute. And if I can be part of the song by my foulsome shoutalongs, then all the better. (Luckily my car has soundproofing).

Another one for me, is the lyrics;

Powerful lyrics and ones that mean something, quite idiosyncratic to me, I will gel with a song.

So, if the kids that I am going to be teaching can articulate (OK, OK, they might need some help with 'articulating') either of these concepts, I might be able to understand their musical tastes and get somewhere with them in making and learning music.

Variations on a theme, softer but no less intense: Opeth - Ghost Of Perdition ( http://songza.com/z/2hrhr1 ....10 mins long ) all the diversity in one song that most bands hope for over an album, or their careers.

OK, I listened to Opeth.....diversity in the instruments and style certainly made it more interesting to listen to for me on a personal level.

I also found this on YouTube: Fear Factory's "Timelessness", used as a backing song to clips from "Saving Private Ryan". I thought both the song (i.e. Fear Factory Timelessness) and the creative vid. pretty good. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hcSFS7JD_A

Homework Assignment: seek out the song "Pixillate" by The Devin Townsend Band. 'Tis from the Synchestra album. Miles softer than the Opeth, in the same progressive vein....more clean vocals as opposed to the shouting (The Townsend has the best clean vocals I've heard)

Failing that, here's "Storm" from the album Accelerated Evolution. It's also the song that got me hooked on his stuff. http://hevydevy.com/audio/mp3/dtb_storm.mp3

Couldn't find "Pixillate" on anything but iTunes, so was limited to a short excerpt (my cashflow situation is really, really in the red), but I did find "Storm" on YouTube (always good to see what the band members look like - that's another thing that kids seem to gel with) and I found this fabulous Devin Townsend "Planet Smasher" song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65gsQucAsfE

So, thanks ClareBear for those thoughts.....really appreciate them, but as always, still wanting to know more. A while back you posted a link to my Q. about "Apocolyptica", and that opened my eyes to the Finnish band I had not heard of. I loved the combination of classical instruments (the cellos) and metal.

Any other ideas to open my understanding of different types of music, would be well appreciated.

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flookwit


Member

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 8:27am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
i'm trying to think of anything that really bombs with me...

....

2) anything sung by meowing cats...i don't hate cats at all...just those stupid cat meow songs.

Eh? What radio station do you listen to, Banjo? You're being cryptically euphemistic, yes??

3).................that song about picking ticks off your girlfriend.

Double WTF?


because there are ticks in it.


if he was a good boyfriend he wouldn't have let her get ticks in the first place, and offered her some fucking bug repellent. but no, he wants to see her nekkid, so no bug repellent for you. INTENTIONAL!

1) Ken?
2)Извините меня? Я не понимаю
3)┬┐Perd├│neme? No entiendo
4)Please explain!
(All of these are places where I have encountered these beasties)

My mind is now playing a scene where I pop into the forest needing a pee, and come out with a tick or three, stuck in my pet beaver :-//
You have no idea how it affects the mating season.

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flookwit


Member

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 8:35am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic


I'll listen to a lot of different stuff, but I always go back to the music I grew up listening to, which is the blues and some jazz. I'm not sure I know why, nostalgia or maybe because I've always been surrounded by it due to my locale. I think it's part of who we are as individuals. That doesn't answer your question, but there you go.

Toby, I am much the same unless I am actively seeking out new music for a reason. I grew up listening only to classical music, mostly Bach, Handel, Chopin, Rachmaninov, Listz. In fact, my parents so disliked "Pop" music, that when I was 3 I was staying with a baby-sitter and told her, when she tuned the radio into the pop/rock station, "Turn that off.....that's bad music....my Mummy says so" !!!

Dad was rather more open to new music, although the Bach Organ Chorales still bring me to tears because those records(LP's Vinyl) were his favourites. (And now are some of mine).

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ClareBear


Moderator

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 8:45am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic


Err, WTF is "vellicates" [sic] above ???


http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/vellicate

Verb

to vellicate (third-person singular simple present vellicates, present participle vellicating, simple past and past participle vellicated)

1: To touch (a body part) lightly so as to excite the surface nerves and cause uneasiness, laughter, or spasmodic movements

2: To irritate as if by a nip, pinch, or tear

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flookwit


Member

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 11:58am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
Really?

I looked in Chambers and The Oxford English Reference Dictionary, both weighty tomes, and neither of them have it listed.......

Chambers: veleta; veil; vell; velleity; vellum; veloce.......

OERD: vela; velamen; velar; Velazquez; Velcro; veld; Velde; veldskoen; veleta; veliger; velitation; velleity; Velleius P; vellum; velocimeter; velocipede; velociraptor; ...........etc.

So, I could have Google 'd it, but I am never 100% certain that Wiki-d is correct. But, I do see that medics have used the word and Johnson, so.......I guess I need to buy an even weightier tome. Anyone got any suggestions?

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Maren


Member

Posted Sun May 18th, 2008 4:38pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
I am going to be involved with teaching music at the 11 -17 year levels and I guess this sort of stuff is what many of them like. So, how the heck do I understand it?

I think there will be no problems for you to understand (to analyse) the music - but maybe problems to understand why they like what they like.
My husband teaches keyboards at a music school and sometimes he comes home shaking his head, asking: am i going to be like my parents who said that my music was no music?
Many of his pupils listen to the charts and are influenced by the mass media. And I think the peer pressure often plays an important role...

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flookwit


Member

Posted Mon May 19th, 2008 3:02am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
Hi Maren! (Waves)

Interesting about your husband. What sort of keyboard skills does he teach? Digital? Acoustic? Historical (harpsichord etc.) I have always wanted to build a harpsichord (we were going to do that in my A'level Music class when I was at school).

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Maren


Member

Posted Mon May 19th, 2008 8:47am Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
Hey, flookwit ,

sorry, no harpsichord ... he mostly teaches the kids on synthesizers but sometimes he also uses the acoustic piano.
(He is member of the section Jazz/Rock/Pop but if a kid wants to play classical music of course it's no problem - for example there's a girl who is crazy about Bach ... ).

His own favourite instrument at the moment is the clavia nord stage piano, but he is not just playing. He also likes to compose and arrange.

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nongenderous


Member

Posted Sun May 25th, 2008 7:06pm Post subject: Muuuuuuuusic
I'm a pop person. Some of the music I like (with myspace-links):

Annie: http://www.myspace.com/anniemusic
Bananarama: http://www.myspace.com/bananarama
Chungking: http://www.myspace.com/chungking20
Cyndi Lauper: http://www.myspace.com/cyndilauper
Donna Summer: http://www.myspace.com/donnasummer
Girls Aloud: http://www.myspace.com/girlsaloud
Gary Numan: http://www.myspace.com/garynuman
Kylie Minogue: http://www.myspace.com/kylieminogue
Tori Amos: http://www.myspace.com/toriamos
The Knife: http://www.myspace.com/theknife
Robyn: http://www.myspace.com/robynmyspace
Terami Hirsch: http://www.myspace.com/teramihirsch

and David Bowie, Kate Bush, Kraftwerk, Dolly Parton, Laurie Anderson.
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