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thesecretlifeofamanicdepressive


Member

Posted Fri Apr 27th, 2007 5:57am Post subject: Our self excluding little club
ive spent inordinate amounts of time simply conveying the idea that there is a response to the thing the person is wishing to happen. having explained it every whch way the person still has the contradiction of bemoaning the lack of the thing that is being offered to him/her. by the health service of this country, by her own words up there in that particular health trust

given that the person has to cope with the vagaries of bp neverthe less it is still unrealistic to say " i wont be seeing that psychiatrist again" when the self same person is asking/reqiring/needing the thing the psychiatrist has. Thats the blog 3 days ago. simply pointing out that contradiction isn't much to do with counselling etc.

Argh, I'm so confused! I didn't once mention not seeing a psychiatrist! I said I'm no longer seeing the psychotherapist who has nothing to do with the mental health trust, it's a young person's charity. The reason I'm not seeing her is because my appointments are at 7pm on a Monday and now I am working that time. She said herself to come back to me when I'm ready as she felt we were going nowhere at the moment because I clam up at mention of my dad.

And yes I moan. The SERVICES ARE INADEQUATE. Up and down the country, people will tell you this. I am not the only one. If people don't protest, nothing changes!

so in the end i say rather bluntly ' look if you want something take it, or stop wasting everybody's compassion and concern in the masquerade of being some kind of social commentary - although we all agree that the blog is more than just that. but in terms of health issues its fundamentally misleading to state that healt care options are missing when in fact they are not, by her own evidence. they may not be quite what she wants, but they are there.

AS for that, get bent. I never said anything was missing- I said it was inadequate. It is inadequate to be forced to wait months for a psychiatric appointment when young trainee psychiatrists are not getting jobs. Medications are hardcore and they need close monitoring. I have not had a Lithium level blood test in four months, have still not had a Depakote check even though I should have done by now. My next appointment is in June. No one is checking on how the hell things are working. The CPN doesn't contact me and is unreachable when I try to contact her. No one has yet taken me off the rapid-cycling inducing antidepressants I am on, so I had to do it myself. I am having insane insomnia and no-one is helping me when I mention it.

I am not unique here. And I resent the implication that I and other people should accept this treatment when it could be better. Just because we're not being chucked in asylums anymore doesn't mean there have been amazing advances in the mental health service. There is still no open discourse and people still constantly imply we should be ashamed of our illnesses. Doctors don't take us seriously, appointments are not made, adverse physical side effects (I have gained 4 stone now and am risking diabetes) are not taken seriously.

It's not good enough.

I also know I can alter my responses to my mood changes but sometimes, in stressful periods, it's simply not possible. I am only human, I am only young and I am doing the best I can with the minimal personal support.

And Crazy is right about the tone. It was insulting. As my sister's comment after you proved. You have been kind and helpful but that was hurtful in tone.

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JVONEARTH


Member

Posted Fri Apr 27th, 2007 8:57am Post subject: Our self excluding little club
Well said!!

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Fri Apr 27th, 2007 11:21am Post subject: Our self excluding little club
Right I am going to depersonalise this right here right now.

Can you understand that there is a difference between a cause and an outcome ie symptom?

It is not necessarily essential or possible to remedy a cause (in this case a chemical brain imbalance) to treat the symptoms of that condition.

However BP sufferers are generally in the dubious position of being able to use chemicals to moderate that aspect of the issue (along with all the problems of that in itself).

However that is not much to do with the position that the outcomes on any given moment, hour, day or week are open to amelioration - improvement.

This is because people's experiences are the sum in any given moment of their thoughts, feelings, behaviours and physiology in that moment or moments.

Each of these 4 aspects of experience is open to an internal dialogue within the individual, unless generally they are psychotic (ie divorced from reality at that moment) through for example schizophrenia, use of drug or excessive alcohol and so on.

The success of that moderating dialogue is affected by a zillion things but in principle unless we are psychotic, organically impaired to some degree, or wilful (which is a choice), in shock or pain, or similar, we can affect how we react to a given thought, impulse, emotion or urge.

Remembering that i am talking about improving the outcome of illness rather than the illness itself, it therefore becomes possible to some degree to affect the outcomes of how we are relating to the external world at that moment. From this it follows that we can begin to direct our actual behaviour to align with our wished for way of operating.

One of my points in general is that a 'biological' as opposed to 'environmental' disorder does not preclude this modification of behaviour and outcomes being possible.

This is supposed to be a hopeful and positive message that reinforces someone's soul and spirit not a point of argument that extends across etherspace in an endless trail of electrons going up their own arses.

As i said i have a diagnosis that is 10 times more difficult to get an NHS response to than BP but even i in my ineptness got what i needed in the end, so so can anyone else including you... in the end

But it does require to work in alliance with the health system, a lesson that took me a long time to learn. I was merely trying to save you some difficulty by putting that on the table, all those many weeks ago.

As regards benefits there is not a shadow of doubt that you are entitled to DLA. the fact that you haven't got it is not your fault, but at the same time you have to modify your tactics so as to get it.

This health system is not shit, the people in it aren't shit and like everything else working with people gets better results than not working with them. Thats a general point.

So make your choices, take them, and enjoy or whatever the outcomes, cos i am sick of the wilfulness here in this interaction.

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RighthoJeeves


Member

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 4:57pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
Been reading some the postings in this section- but what is the difference between Bipolar and BPD? doesnt the D stand for disorder? Isnt it the full name of this condition? Forgive me if I am wrong. I have Bipolar Type I (1) and my husband has Rapid Change Bipolar- how ever that is classed medically- so do I have Bipolar or BPD and how about my husband? I should know but I thought Bipolar and BPD were one in the same- please ell me the difference

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 7:19pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
Hi, confusing isn't it.

About Bipolar Disorder...

- not my diagnosis but people here seem to refer to it as 'BP', and I can only assume this is BiPolar disorder. Personally I would say its nomenclature is BD for Bipolar Disorder.

BPD is Borderline Personality Disorder...BPD. It can also besignified as Emotionally-unstable Personality Disorder, particularly in Europe.

They are completetely different diagnoses, except they share a remarkable amount of symptoms, and by symptom I mean the consequence of a condition. Eg. someone has the cold virus, they have a cold - condition. A symptom of a cold, is sneezing. However, sneezing is also a symptom of hayfever. So, there you have two different conditions, one a virus, the other an allegy, both sharing the same symptom, sneezing. in both cases, if you treat them at all, you treat the symptom, not the condition. I think this is accurate, but I am not a medical doctor, but i think this makes sense to most people.

There is a publication called the DSM-IV, published by the American Psychiatric Association. This is the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Edition IV (4). It is very widely used in British psychiatry. There are arguments surrounding this publication about categorising or medicalising people, but effectively this is a peripheral issue.

DSM-IV is divided into five sections or 'axes'.

Axis 1 is 'Clinical syndromes and other conditions that may be a focus of clinical attention', and includes 'all mental disorders except personality disorders and mental retardation'. Bipolar, which is a Mood Disorder is in this axis.

Axis 2 is 'Pesonality Disorders, which are lifelong,deeply ingrained, inflexible and maladaptive traits and behaviours which may occur quite independently of Axis 1 clinical disorders. These are likely to affect an individual's ability to be treated.

Axis 3 is 'General medical conditions', Axis 4 is 'Psychosocial and environmental problems, eg divorce, bereavement', and Axis 5 is 'Global assessment of functioning, indicating a ratu=ing of a persons psychological, social, and occupational functioning.'

Axes 3 and 4 are included because the are factors which affect the therapeutic response to Axes 1 and/or 2.

Sources:

Gross, R. & McIlveen, R. (2005). Abnormal Psychology. London: Hodder & Stoughton Educational.

DSM-IV. (1994). American Psychiatric Association - The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders - Fourth Edition.


This is why the response to BPD is DBT/CBT and to BP it is medication + CBT and especially DBT. Dialectical Behavioural Therapy.he similar symptoms of Bipolar and BPD are things like selh-harm, mood shift, reckless behaviour, compulsive spending, suicide ideation and so on.

The important thing to recognise is that, altough the behaviours are very similar, the causes are very different.

However, my personal belief, and the view of the medical team treating me for BPD (cos I have asked them) is that the causes don't matter so much as changing the symptoms or behavioural outcomes of the disorders, BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT WE EXPERIENCE, and so effectively, being Chris is all the things that make up what Chris experiences - the pain, the joy, the problems, the achievements... all of which are defined by what I do, where i go, my aims and so on. In turn, thes are the outcomes of my thoughts, feelings and behaviours, within my environmental setting.

This is why the therapeutic response to BPD is CBT/DBT and to Bipolar is medication + CBT and especially DBT (Dialectical Behavioural Therapy)

Google this and also:

Linehan, M. (1993). Skills Training Manual for treating Borderline Personality Disorder. New York: Guilford Press.

I have no problem with the stigma of mental health, and am happy to say what my life is, because it's me, and anyone who has prejudices about mh is simply sad, like racists and homophobes etc.

So i am quite happy to say in the context of explaining the answer to your question is that the diagnosis i am blessed with is Complex (ie enduring) PTSD with BPD. The PTSD occurred because of an event at age 8 weeks (ie hidden to me) and the BPD developed through the years 3 to about 6 or 7, and i just built my own grave from there on, until, after a brilliant career in motor racing for about 20 years, as a race car builder, my life suddenly colllapsed in 1999. The only brilliant bit of the racing career was the work i did, the relationships in the workplace was catastrophic, but people put up with that cos i was good at my job. in the end even i couldn't live with the accumulated fuck-ups of a lifetime of personality disorde, and since then i have been in the care of the mental health services. This was a disaster for the first 5 years, including a 6 month spell with Toyota F1 in Cologne, but since part 2 of my patient-ship, and the last three years of it within a proper treatment regime of DBT team, ie a team of 3 psychotherapists between the four of us on the programme ( which is minimum 60 weeks at 4 hours per week), keyworker, psychiatrist and care coordinator, i am going to be discharged around christmas, and even now feel 'not disordered'.


None of this intervention can alter the causes of the two diagnoses , they were events and development issues, and the organic and 'biological' elements of Bipolar cannot yet be altered, only modified by meds. BUT, you ani can sure alter how it AFFECTS you and i.

That really is my point, and has been all the way through my posting here aon this brilliant space

THANK YOU MR. FRY, thank you, Stephen.

Hope that answers your question, and encourages others to do things that makes the experience of Bipolar, and Depression and Anxiety, more manageable in their lives, and therefore have richer lives.


Chris

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 7:38pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
My cat, Lucy, has disposed of Algebra in just two weeks and is now staring on Calculus. It's incredible cos she's only 21 months old! There's a picture of her in the pet's bit.

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Crazy_in_a_box


Member

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 11:08pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
My cat, Lucy, has disposed of Algebra in just two weeks and is now staring on Calculus. It's incredible cos she's only 21 months old! There's a picture of her in the pet's bit.

?

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 11:23pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
She's just a very clever cat, Crazy.

Her brother is quite normal. He miows a lot. He thinks mainly about food, sleeping and chaasing various flying insects.


Lucy

Lucy's Dad

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Crazy_in_a_box


Member

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 11:27pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
Im not doubting your cat's ability or intelligence... Im more confused as to where the topic came out of and what its doing here?????

Its a bit random....

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 11:34pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
It's just that the previous post (also by me) was a bit serious, and in a moment of manic madness i wanted to kinda undo my sad seriousness. Also show that I am completely bonkers. I do feel very guilty that I have used my cat to propagate my agenda, and am going to discuss my lapse in my psychotherapy on Tuesday...

->

Apologies to all who have been offended by my frippery, and to Atari for subverting her system.

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Crazy_in_a_box


Member

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 11:41pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
Also show that I am completely bonkers


Why do you feel you need to show that you are completely bonkers?

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Anonymous


Unregistered

Posted Sat Apr 28th, 2007 11:56pm Post subject: Our self excluding little club
umm... good point, may be i don't., but mainly to show that i'm not sad and boring like an old raincoat abandned, redundant in a alleyway somewhere in Greenwich Village, the melancholy strains of saxaphone from the diner on the corner drifting over the sad crumpled cloth of abandoned hopes....

:'(

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