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JVONEARTH


Member

Posted Mon Feb 12th, 2007 10:14pm Post subject: Suicide
Just watching a programme about fathers who kill themselves
My mates brother at 17 went into the back garden put a shot gun in his mouth and blew his brains out Not a nice thing to see.
But what is your opinion of someone who does that?
I don't (and this is just my opinion)think they are cowards. In a way for whatever reason someone does that i think they have got guts.
I know there are dim views about this subject and to be honest i have thought about it a few times but just wanted to hear what other people thought of it.

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Fourth Feline


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 1:17pm Post subject: Suicide
I feel a great sympathy for those who take their own life and also those left behind. I have never attempted suicide myself, but have been very close sometimes.
My humble observation is that when one reaches that level of desperation, the mind has almost (if not fully) entered an altered state of perception - a place where no rationale can readily enter.
I feel that The non depressive tends to assume that the suicide is making the decision from their own 'normal' standpoint, when in truth the deeply depressed and/or psychotic has already slipped across into a different seat/place of perception.

I was hospitalised with some people who had tried and failed suicide about 3-4 years ago and it was obvious they were going to try again upon release - as for them it had become such a logical path to take.

I also used to know a husband and wife team that worked for Manchester social services, who were dismissive of the 'suicidal personality' and believed it to be cowardice. I feel it was no co-incidence that they were quite shallow and self congratulating human beings. Too numb to feel real emotion, be it happiness or despair.

I just want to send my love, respect and support out to those considering this rather final act, and just say that I hope they are still around in ten years time reflecting upon when they were almost a suicide

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meekychuppet


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 1:37pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

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AxmxZ


Moderator

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 3:26pm Post subject: Suicide
I went to a small high school in central Texas. My graduating class was 102 people; it was supposed to be 105.

A dude killed himself in our junior year: ran away from school and jumped off a nearby cliff - we were situated high on top of a hill, surrounded by near unpassable bush leading down to a river. It took the detectives several months to find his remains, and they only recognized him by his Hawaiian shirt.

Another kid that was supposed to be in our class but got kicked out for potentially being a liability due to psychiatric issues really did become a liability several months later.

Then a friend of mine killed himself our senior year - hung himself on the eve of the Theology final. He always did have an odd sense of humor. By that point the newspapers started picking up on this weirdness and running speculative articles about our bloody lemming class.

Our last self-inflicted casualty happened last February: a really brilliant Hopi kid from the 2000 class descended into alcoholism in Los Angeles and killed himself. He was heavily involved in outdoors activities when he was in high school, and most of the outdoors club was from the 2001 class, so far more people from our class showed up for his funeral than from his. By-word at the funeral was, predictably, "We've got to stop meeting like this." It's kind of sad when the only reasons your class gets together is to bury a peer.

As to why they did it... I can't generalize, obviously, but there's probably a reason why some parents send their kids away to a school deep in the hills where no one is allowed on or off campus without permission. Academics and sports aside, it's a great excuse not to deal with your offspring if they start being a handful. Not that we were considered a school slash prison for young psychos and criminals, just the opposite - the understanding was that everything was super-fluffy and safe and friendly. People left their stuff everywhere without being afraid of theft, and a single fight was grounds for expulsion. A very expensive boarding school for the very rich and whatever poor kids they select to add to the "diversity" bouquet. But if you have to live with the constant thought that you're here because you're too much trouble for your folks to handle, then that probably doesn't help. It's not like every parent dotingly called every night and came to visit and have lunch with you on weekends.

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trouser material


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 6:08pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

You have a lot of rage.

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meekychuppet


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 6:46pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

You have a lot of rage.

Not rage - just two approaches to anything. Very direct or extremely direct.

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Tourmaline


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 7:38pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

That pisses me off too. It's like telling someone dying of cancer that they're just not brave enough or not fighting hard enough. Complete bollocks.

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trouser material


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 8:13pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

You have a lot of rage.

Not rage - just two approaches to anything. Very direct or extremely direct.
Don't get me wrong, i agree with you. You just sound as tactless as me.

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meekychuppet


Member

Posted Tue Feb 13th, 2007 9:17pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

You have a lot of rage.

Not rage - just two approaches to anything. Very direct or extremely direct.
Don't get me wrong, i agree with you. You just sound as tactless as me.

In my experience tact is an extremely overrated quality.

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trouser material


Member

Posted Wed Feb 14th, 2007 7:16pm Post subject: Suicide
I have heard the cowardice thing before. I always want to headbutt the person saying it.

You have a lot of rage.

Not rage - just two approaches to anything. Very direct or extremely direct.
Don't get me wrong, i agree with you. You just sound as tactless as me.

In my experience tact is an extremely overrated quality.

Perhaps. However it is also, occasionally, an essential one.

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Emma18


Member

Posted Wed Feb 14th, 2007 10:19pm Post subject: Suicide
My father commited suicide 8 years ago when I was 10. I have found as I have got older that Suicide is still very much a 'taboo' subject, and so I have found that I haven't spoken much about it. I think many people don't know what to say to someone when they mention the word suicide.
I really wish it was talked about more. It would certainly help me get over it quicker and help towards more understanding for those who don't realise what its like.
Also, I admire my Dad for the courage that he showed to do such a brave thing, as it must have been really hard for him to make the decision, although I don't think he was thinking straight at the time. Nevertheless, I has left me with alot of problems, so I do have a little anger towards him (but not much...I can't blame him for what he did).

p.s. Hello everyone! Lovely to join you all....BIG fan of Mr. Fry

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trouser material


Member

Posted Thu Feb 15th, 2007 11:24am Post subject: Suicide
Suicide is a very delicate subject, highlighted by what happened to you at such a delicate age.

It should be addressed more, publicly, so people can understand if they are having black thoughts they're not alone.

Welcome, emma

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Fourth Feline


Member

Posted Thu Feb 15th, 2007 3:38pm Post subject: Suicide
Welcome Emma,

Sorry to hear about your loss. I applaud the even handed nature of your reaction and how you have found your way to an understanding of this indeed delicate subject.

Regards,

Derek.

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Charlie


Member

Posted Thu Feb 15th, 2007 11:04pm Post subject: Suicide
I'd say categorically NO.

I'd say cowardice never enters the mind of a truely manically depressed individual. I would say the rationale behind dying was a very logical one when I considered the tracks of an oncoming train. If the pain continued as it was for the rest of my life (which I believed it would) then to die is the answer . I new I wasn't in control of my emotions and I had absolutely no reason to be depressed, on the contrary everything was happening for me, but i was absolutely depressed to the core. Dying seemed the logical option and if someone had assured me I'd have definately died I would have done it.

It may have been cowardice that stopped me. My logic was if I don't pull it off people will know I made a suicide attempt and I'll have to be around to face the consequences. That would have been simply awful, A failed suicide attempt on the record, how awful.

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AxmxZ


Moderator

Posted Thu Feb 15th, 2007 11:38pm Post subject: Suicide


It may have been cowardice that stopped me. My logic was if I don't pull it off people will know I made a suicide attempt and I'll have to be around to face the consequences. That would have been simply awful, A failed suicide attempt on the record, how awful.

What odd reasoning.... it's not all that difficult to do. All you need is a container of bleach and several seconds without parental supervision. If you'd let something like a short death agony stop you, you never *really* wanted to die in the first place, mate. You just didn't particularly want to live anymore. That's not called being suicidal - that's called being bored.

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