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Marcin.Opa


Member

Posted Sat Nov 12th, 2011 12:55am Post subject: The lack of words...

Hello,

I am new to the forum and would like to introduce myself before I express my feelings and thoughts. My name is Marcin (Polish equivalent of Martin), I currently live in Southampton and only recently, literally fell in love with Sir Fry's work as I think he is really an exceptional person, but there is one thing that would not let me sleep well at night...

My lack of words... In this case, however, it is not about the lack in the meaning of words, as the lack of any words that could describe my feelings about Sir Stephen Fry's comment about The Third Reich's largest concentration camp in Poland, Auschwitz, where he said " There has been a history, let's face it, in Poland of a right-wing Catholicism which has been deeply disturbing for those of us who know a little history, and remember which side of the border Auschwitz was on and know the stories, and know much of the anti-semitic, and homophobic and nationalistic elements in countries like Poland ". I know it has been quite some time from that particular event, but I still do not understand his behaviour. That quoted sentence has no sense what so ever, particularly the words: "those of us who know a little history, and remember which side of the border Auschwitz was on and know the stories"...what did he mean by that? Poland was entirely invaded by Germany and it has nothing to do where the concentration camps were, as mainly it was all under German and Soviet control, there was no Poland, therefore was no Polish borders...I even refuse to comment on the "know the stories" bit, which is completely and utterly ridiculous, as Sir Fry himself ridiculed people who even started a sentence with words like "apparently" that was an effect of stupid and unthoughtful speculations or gossip, and from my point of view the word "stories" is even worse but falls under the same category.
Now, about the infamous Catholicism, I do not believe in any godly entities overseeing us myself as I grew a brain, even though I have been brought up in a strictly Catholic family, and I am not proud of what happened to that country because of it, but I believe that without it we would be doomed as well but from a different angle. The reason is quite simple, as during the First and the Second World War priests helped a lot of people by giving out food rations, hiding people in the churches providing shelter, giving hope to the society risking their own lives, but it was in the past, and from loving and caring people priests evolved into child abusing, greedy politicians. "Thank God" that the religion itself is dying very slowly, but consequently, at least in Poland. Nowadays people are starting to think instead of cultivating the ways of their parents or ancestors as they often refer to. During the occupation it was easier to believe in something, in this case God, that would give just a bit of hope needed to survive, where as believing in science in those days would be useless at any given point.
Nationalism is fundamental in my country (bearing in mind that it comes in many different strands)...you do not have to be smart to figure that out, all in all we have been invaded too many times, not even mentioning the three partitions of Poland. It really should not be a surprise to people that we have to keep out nationalism not to get "ripped apart" again...in my perspective it is just common sense.
The last thing but not the least, I am fully aware of the vast numbers of homophobes (although I have many gay friends and I am very respectful towards others no matter how different from me, I will never, and I say that again, NEVER approve of homosexual couples raising children...that is just sick and wrong in my opinion and I always say it openly as my point of view), alcoholics, thieves or the worst of them all: neo-nazis in very scarce numbers, but still, NEO-NAZIS in country like Poland!? which for me is completely unbelievable and leaves me breathless, BUT...but please, please please! I beg of you people, do not judge the whole society on the wrongdoings of the few...I leave you with that thought and wish everyone who reads my topic a good day :wink:, Thank you.


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Nitro


Member

Posted Tue Jan 17th, 2012 5:04am Post subject: The lack of words...

1) Mr.Fry is not 'Sir' Stephen Fry. That is something I think the Queen decides and far as I know, it's not been decided and I can't imagine, unless he's always acting which I doubt, Mr.Fry himself would suggest happening.

2) You have a right to be proud of your country as any citizen does.

3) Mr.Fry says things that do not go over well sometimes. Neither do you. Nor I. Nor anyone else that might be identified as 'human'. I'm not being an apologist for him, he doesn't need it anyway. I'm only suggesting that if you can remember that a person is a human being first, like yourself, you might be able to imagine they are not PURPOSEFULLY and CONSCIOUSLY planning to hurt you by having an opinion or just not stringing all sentences together perfectly. I would be TOAST if that standard were applied to me. Wouldn't you? NOBODY, NOBODY, NOBODY can be 100% conscious 100% of the time of answering a question honestly as themselves and also be 100% eloquent, not even actors ( cause, they wouldn't be themselves in an interview...see? ). To expect it or think it exists is believing an illusion. I would find it beyond absurd to believe Mr.Fry is unapproving of the whole of Poland; past, present, and future. Seriously..come on, be reasonable.

4) I have no idea why I'm creating a list.

5) It seemed like a good idea at that time, and now, not so much.

Oops, forgot one...

6) There are many times I've thought that there are many adults, including myself, who might've had far happier, well adjusted childhoods if they'd had two daddies or two mommies who loved them unconditionally than one daddy and/or one mommy who abused them. IOW, you have a right to your belief, but mine is that two LOVING parents are a far better alternative to one traditional model of parents that can create a living hell for themselves and a child. Love doesn't disgust me so much as the idea of orphaned, abandoned, and abused children do. Plenty of straight folks, unfortunately, have proven capable of that.

Really? Wow.

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joan


Member

Posted Fri Jan 20th, 2012 2:34pm Post subject: The lack of words...

Marcin said:
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I will never, and I say that again, NEVER approve of homosexual couples raising children...that is just sick and wrong in my opinion and I always say it openly as my point of view.
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A person's sexuality is not chosen - it is inborn. For this reason, we know that giving people reduced human rights because of their sexuality is just plain wrong.

Marcin - you need to accept that it is perfectly normal for some people to be gay. There are nice gays and nasty gays, bright ones and stupid ones, right wing and left wing, religious and atheist, AND those who want families and those who don't. What business is it of any of us to judge them as unworthy of having children? In any case, many gay people already have children before accepting their own sexuality, so if it is wrong for gay people to bring up kids, should these children be taken away from them? I don't think you believe this.

Please reconsider your attitude as it is most certainly homophobic. I feel you do not want to be like that, so you need to do some serious scientific and sociological thinking, and accept the reality about homosexuality. It is normal. It is not sick. There is no logical reason for discrimination, even though hatred, suspicion, discrimination and outright bullying are still prevalent.

It is easy for me - I was brought up from early childhood to accept all people and never discriminate or judge. I realise it is very hard for people with a religious background, even if they've rejected those beliefs, to rise above the brainwashing. It is especially hard when society and laws are intrinsically homophobic.

But remember, even those of us born hetero might one day have a gay child or grandchild. Wouldn't we all want to work for a world of acceptance, if only for their sakes?


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Nitro


Member

Posted Mon Jan 23rd, 2012 2:25am Post subject: The lack of words...

This->"Wouldn't we all want to work for a world of acceptance, if only for their sakes?"

Beautiful sentiment Joan and sums it up quite nicely imnsho

Really? Wow.

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ArleneA


Member

Posted Thu Mar 22nd, 2012 1:52pm Post subject: The lack of words...

I had a "lack of words" moment this morning. I was walking along my high street in Fife where I live.

At this moment in time we have a Continental Market from Europe visiting us. I was browsing some of the stalls; then noticed some rather nice cushions. I thought to myself "yes those would match perfectly with my colour scheme in my livingroom" I had no money on me at this point, so put the cushion back for the time being. Much to my surprise the stall owner came rushing up to the said cushion, picked it up and over the toply 'placed' it back on the pile of other cushions. Whilst doing this he was shaking his head saying "yeah thanks, lady, you just treated that cushion like a piece of s**t" I was overwhelmed with a complete "lack of words" I carried on walking, analysing whether I did indeed treat the cushion like a piece of s**t(!) I certainly did not. I asked my friend to confirm this I said "Did I treat that cushion like a piece of s**t?" He said no way ha ha.

The moral of this small unfortunate incident is that I really liked those cushions and was intending to purchase said cusions; but after getting spoken to like a piece of s**t I shall refrain from doing so! One has her pride to think of.

Negative comments eat away at me at the best of times. This comment dwelled on my mind for a good couple of hours I have to say!! I have no idea why I could not have just brushed this comment off:(

"This is me - don't try and change it..."

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joan


Member

Posted Fri Mar 23rd, 2012 4:03am Post subject: The lack of words...

I found the perfect antidote to feeling bad after encountering such an attitude. I say to myself - 'Some poor sod has to live with that arsehole and I'm so happy it isn't me!"

It always does the trick.


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ArleneA


Member

Posted Fri Mar 23rd, 2012 6:51am Post subject: The lack of words...

Ha ha, yes you are right, Joan! I cannot believe how bad I felt about the possibility of being mean to a cushion!! Unreal. I didn't think cushions had feelings at all In saying that, had I 'thrown' the cushion or trampled on it a few times first before putting it back maybe then he would have been slightly justified in his comments; but no, one was very civilised, and 'put' the cushion down where it belonged.

I bet those cushions are desperate for a good home!!

"This is me - don't try and change it..."

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joan


Member

Posted Fri Aug 3rd, 2012 11:54pm Post subject: The lack of words...

I have a salt and pepper pot shaped like two cats, and I feel guilty if I place them facing away from each other. They have to be able to talk! How daft is that? We can all be guilty of anthropomorphism.


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